Paggeldiwwer

On many major events with hundreds of members in costume, we are used to have the officers to guide the groups which wear helmets. These officers are responsible for guiding the troopers through the day, organize the stops and the photo-services for the visitors. If theses officers need to wear glasses, they should keep them on all the time. They have to take care for others (troopers AND fans) which weights in far more than a costume accuracy in this moment. This was spoken from the point of an event-coordinator.
 
From the point of the nit-picking "Akkurazzi" (funny term here in Germany for accuracy-loving nerds) I am voting against glasses - especially for face characters. But this is a ridicolous point of view, as we are not in space but only pretending to be there  Of course the glasses shall be spared for approval-photos.
 
But to be realistic: we can't deny any member to wear theirs glasses because these are a medical need for some, especially for those who can't take contact lenses. If some take the glasses off for pictures it is perfectly fine and makes the photo look better. But as we can see: even in the Star Wars universe we have characters wearing glasses. This is no shame- it's human  

Safety first. Seeing is important.
I recommend removing them for photos whenever possible, especially approval submissions. Other than that, no biggy.  

I want to link to the thread Marc started in the ISB section regarding the Imperial Army Operations Officer  (that´s the best term i heard so far) and propose a first draft for a future CRL based on the great work done over for the Fahrenheit 451 ANH staff officer.
 
 
So here we go:
 
Imperial Army Operations Officer from ANH   Imperial Hat, black
For 501st approval: Fabric is a medium weight suiting material matching the pants and tunic if applicable.  Gabardine style weave is most accurate. Base of the hat is conical, with a crown about 4" (101.6 mm) tall. Front and rear "flaps" overlap on the sides and are about 4" (101.6 mm) high. Front bill extends 3" down, decorated with 5, 6 or 7 concentric stitches. Imperial Code Disk is positioned in the center of the front vertical flap.  
 For level two certification (if applicable): Code Disk has a notch detail on the outermost disk.
 For level three certification (if applicable): Code disk exactly matches screen-used prop.  
 Tunic, lightgrey
For 501st approval: Fabric should be a medium weight suiting material exactly matching the pants and hat. Cavlary Twill weave is most accurate. Tunic is double-breasted with a left over right closure on at the right shoulder-seam. The back of the tunic replicates the front by the given look of the double breasted design of the front. Yoke closes up across the shoulder to the top shoulder seam. The standing collar has square corners and is about 1.6" (40.6 mm) tall and closes snugly There are code cylinder pockets on both outside panels of the jacket from about half way between the top and bottom on the arm hole. Sleeves are long, and without decoration, containing 2 seams, one along the bottom and one along the back. The rear seam opens at the cuffs at a length of about 3" (75mm) Tunic should be constructed with top-stitching (stitches visible on the exterior surface of fabric) 0,25" (6mm) from the outer edges of the double breast/double back, 1" (2,54mm) from the outer edge of the double breast/double back and directly underneath the edge of the codecylinder-pockets Hook and eye fasteners on the uniform should not be visible.  
 For level two certification (if applicable): There is a dart of about 2" (50.8 mm) in the top center of the yoke. The back of the tunics' replicated double-breast opens at both lower pleats.  
 For level three certification (if applicable): Tunic must be secured on the right side by snaps or buttons, not Velcro. There is no topstitching visible anywhere but at the noted points. a lining must be sewn in
 Rank Bar
For 501st approval: See the Imperial Rank Bar page for more information. Worn on the left side of the tunic over the heart. Rank consists of colored plastic tiles mounted on a metal bar The bar is 1" (25.4 mm) height. Length is determined by chosen rank Rank tile dimensions are 1/2" (12.7 mm)width x 3/4" (19 mm) height and about 1/8" (3.2 mm). Tiles are mounted with 1/4" (6.4 mm) spaces between them. Rank tiles are translucent. Color quantity and combinations are determined by rank, and are appropriate to uniform type. For example:  No Grand Moffs wore grey uniforms with hats.  Grand Admiral rank matches Grand Admiral uniform... etc.)  
 For level two certification (if applicable): Rank bar consists of six tiles.
 For level three certification (if applicable): Belt box, code cylinder, and rank badge configuration is consistent with film canon officers. Rank bar consists of colored plastic push buttons mounted on an metal bar There are only Four choices of rank bar for ANH Army Operations officers One row of six red tiles. One row of three red tiles and three amber tiles.  
   Belt
For 501st approval: The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) from the buckle. The belt may be worn with the snap to the right or left of the wearer. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Imperial Code Disk at the center. Please refer to the Imperial Buckle reference page for information on accurate and inaccurate style buckles.  
 For level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather. Snap is worn to the left of the wearer. Buckle is flat.
 For level three certification (if applicable): ANH Staff Officers should have a belt with undyed edges.    
 Jodhpur Trousers, black
For 501st approval: Fabric is a medium weight suiting material exactly matching the tunic and hat. Gabardine style weave is most accurate. Flared riding breeches are canon. Breeches must be worn with boots. Pockets are acceptable, although they are not visible with the tunic on.  
 Officer Boots
For 501st approval: Knee-high, black, lace-less, smooth non-textured, leather or leather-like material. Rubber is not acceptable. PVC or synthetic material is allowed as long as it gives the appearance of leather. There are no stretch panels, buckles, snap tabs, or decoration. Boots have conservative heels. If zippers are present, they are hidden on the inner part of the boot shaft. Not visible from the front, side or back. The top of the boots may be flat or Spanish Style, but not Cowboy or Super Hero (pointed at the front) style.  
 For level two certification (if applicable): Boots do not have a zipper.
 For level three certification (if applicable): Boots are made of leather. Not vinyl or PVC. Exact replicas of English riding (dress) boots or Equestrian boots.
 
Optional Accessories
Items below are optional costume accessories. These items are not required for approval, but if present appear as described below.   Belt Boxes
For 501st approval: Dimensions are approximately 2 1/2" (63.5 mm) by 3 1/2" (88.9 mm) by 1" (25.4 mm) thick.. Two boxes may be worn horizontally on either side of the belt buckle. Placement of the screw / rivet for the belt boxes should be on the shortest side (left and right for horizontal) An uneven number of boxes is incorrect. Box surfaces are smooth and have no decoration/ hinges/ visible holes or slots that do not appear on the screen-used boxes.    For level two certification (if applicable): There is a covering on the back of each box with a slightly overlapping lip that is approximately 1/4” (6.35 mm). Covering is secured by a rivets or small screws, on the top and on the bottom.      
 
 
 

Sorry to hear that Marc

After many years of hoping this figure would be made I finally have it
 

Some more impressions of our German Garrisons Weekend in Speyer:
 



 
Great to know that some of the people on the group-picture are around here on the IOC  Our friends from our neighbor-Garrisons in France and Luxemburg for example. I hope we meet more often and share our enthusiasm!

Last saturday in Speyer/Germany, Kevin and I were happy to meet and troop together
 

 
Thank you for the pleasant troop, Kevin. I am sure we will do some more in the future!

The next step would be an own Mitaka-CRL, an own Canady-CRL, an own Datoo-CRL, an own Peavey-CRL, an own Piett-CRL, an own Ozzel-CRL, an own Motti-CRL, an own Yularen-CRL, an own Tagge-CRL and many more for sure. So there's a lot of work ahead for us to create all those new CRL's. But it would honor the IOC to create all these specific CRL's. Look at the Clone Trooppers Detachment: they have such a large amount of CRL's for each and every kind of trooper-color-shemes. So why should we not be able to do the same?

Then there must also be an opening in the back, or you won't get this on. Zipper in the back? ._.

That was also my first thought. Naturally members aid each other to get in costume, but all imperial/FO uniforms habe a funcional design. A tunic with a zipper in the back is the exact opposite of being functional.

I will make a main character looks different from the other generic even if they were wearing the same outfit. (Off-Topic) If you compare to the other movies like Rose and Colonel, their color is much different from one and other (if base off the TFA and TLJ visual dictionary). 

If they are a different grey, then the colour is barely a few shades, not enough to warrant a new CRL.
I've been watching gameplay footage, as discussed on the previous thread yesterday. In shade and non-direct overhead lighting, the colours are barely imperceptible. It's why my draft incorporated "The Battlefront 2 First Order Uniform" because they're the same, I would argue. I would highly recommend folks check out the two youtube video links I posted in the previous thread and see how the "fabric" of the generic uniform behaves in shade. It does get quite dark! We never see Hask dashing across the plains of Jakku, or bopping around on Takodana, so it's not possible to say his uniform would behave the same way. We -can- see how the generics behave in shade and low-light. I'm still digging for hi quality footage of the officers on Starkiller as it's a less warmly-lit map with hopefully some low-lit interior areas to get some more comparisons.

For Hask to receive his own named character CRL when a generic is identical, considering a Lieutenant Mitaka CRL was submitted, altered into a "generic Lieutenant with caveat for Mitaka appearance" after LMO discussion with the CRL model, and then published with zero appearance caveats for any named officers (same for Major/Col.) then the precedent here has been set.

It's the same uniform, same seams, same accessories (multiplayer generics have access to a handful of other pistol options). Hask is just another dude in the same uniform as all other FO in Battlefront 2. It was suggested in the prior thread that Hask be added as a Level 2/3 clearance level for those wishing to emulate specific officers/characters, which is what was also suggested for the FO Lieutenant and Major.

If this is how new CRL's for uniforms worn by multiple persons are being created and released, then I feel that the precedent has to stick all the way through.

There were some changes to the uniforms between TFA and TLJ which were possibly included in the game as well. One difference is, as Joey stated, the darker fabric of the tunics. This is concerning the drak Grey as well as the dark teal. Both are dartker in the new movie.
 


 
Additionally the have put in minor changes to the pattern. The loops for the code-cylinders were lifted by a few centimeters, the collar grew higher and looks more stiff. The shoulders have been improved in hight and they put in a new logo-design for the FO-emblem on the hat.
 
The main differences between the TLJ-tunic and Hasks tunic are the missing seam-line underneath the code-cylinder-Loops and the missing epaulettes. But all the other components seem to be there. This get's me back to my suggestion of beginning to split the CRL at L2 for either the movie or the game. I think having a whole new CRL is not necessary here, but we can work out the required components for L2 for the movie- and the game-tunic and end up for the specific face-characters at L3.
 
 
Edit: can on please tell my, why my post are getting so Long (without any content) when I am putting in pictures? As you can see, the text is underneath the pictures. That's why I do not think the pictures are the problem... perhaps one could tell me how to solve this problem. Thank you

Question: Can't the CRL for the darkgrey/charcoal FO-uniform just be handled as easy as this:
 
Basic Approval: All FO-Captains, Lieutenants/Commanders
Level 2: you can optionally go for the movie-uniform or for the Battlefront 2-uniform
Level 3: specific face-characters (which would cover all the Hask's, Peavey's, Mitakas and others with this tunic)
 
???
 
This is how it was done before with the imperial officers and it works
 

The CRL only says "correct clip". We disussed this issue here somewhere but the clips sometimes give a silverish-brasslike-look where it is difficult to tell if it is silver or brass. I think the Picture from the CRL really is a nice reference for this question as it looks a bit silverish as well as a bit like brass.
The Staff Officer uniform with the now so called "imperial pattern" is seen on the Navy Troopers in ESB (there were no Staff Officers in this movie) later on the Staff/Warrant Officers and IN's in RotJ and finally on those in Rogue One (even though they had some minor changes to the pattern in R1).
 

Question: Can't the CRL for the darkgrey/charcoal FO-uniform just be handled as easy as this:
 
Basic Approval: All FO-Captains, Lieutenants/Commanders
Level 2: you can optionally go for the movie-uniform or for the Battlefront 2-uniform
Level 3: specific face-characters (which would cover all the Hask's, Peavey's, Mitakas and others with this tunic)
 
???
 
This is how it was done before with the imperial officers and it works
 

I just found one pic that really gives that appearance too:

 
 

Yes, there is somework wiating on those three CRL's für ANH-ISB, ANH-Warrant-Officer and ANH-Navy Trooper. And you, Patricia, did an awesome job in the research for these specific uniforms. Think it's up to the DL and the LMO if and when these things could happen.

I agree with Marc, it would be interesting to know where the progress is at the moment and if anything is still needed to publish it.

That section can continue as is, it isn't for posting proposed CRLs, but costume  submissions that aren't covered by the Database.    Please refer to paragraph 2 of post one of that thread.
 
Thanks for the clarification Marc.

We had approvals in the German Garrison with staff officers and double rank-bars. Event though they were not seen in ANH nor in RotJ we wer always approving them. Today, since the Change, I would go on approving them as Long as there is reference for this. And we have a bunch of reference to this it appears.
 
I have to confirm the view on the ANH-Fahrenheit 451-Unifom. The current Staff Officer CRL is not correct and needs to be split in two: one for the ANH-Staff Officer, another for the RotJ (without any rankbar), R1, Comics, Games... Everything else would not cover the reality.
 
Making the single bar rankbar level one but being imprecisely considering the real configuration of a ANH-Uniform in L3 is in contradiction to itself and should be corrected soon. The wording: "ANH officers wear a uniquely designed tunic with subtle differences that are only seen in ANH. Costumers may choose to replicate this design in lieu of the standard officer tunic, but only if doing an ANH Staff Officer." is far too inaccurate next to the fact that the Fahrenheit 451-Uniform differs in a great many ways to the "regular cut" of the officers tunic. These differences are not subtle - they are obvious!
 
If one should call me for doing work on a "real" ANH-Staff Officer's CRL - just give me a call
 
Then - and only then - a single bar rankbar makes sense for the ANH Staff Officers. But in this Moment we should have the RotJ/R1/Comic/Game-CRL for the black uniform already in hands.
   

Yes, I agress. We need a CRL Staff Officer ANH (451 Fahrenheit uniform) and a CRL Staff officer (R1/comics/BF2) with a hat and helmet option. We also need a Navy trooper/warrant officer ANH (NY police tunic) CRL were one option is the helmet with DH-17 plus holster and the other option is a hat and no blaster. We might be able to put the R1 navy trooper in that CRL as well and say that option needs to have the R1 IN helmet, R1 belt boxes and a SE-14 blaster including the holster. Perhaps we can put the navy trooper ESB, navy trooper dress uniform ROTJ and warrant officer ROTJ in the same CRL.

I noticed that no one has put pictures of the FO Colonel from the Heroes of the Galaxy game yet, so here they are!
I realize, of course, that we can't see much details in this game, and there is no guarantee that even what we see really is screen accurate, but still I think they're interesting enough to share, if only because we can see him from every angle  
 

 
The gloves look plain like Hux's, but again I'm not sure how accurate those game characters are, plus it's hard to say since it's pretty pixelized.
But at least we can clearly see the two seams in the back of the tunic, plus the seams in the hat, which are probably screen accurate. 

First of all, yay for teal officers! Can't wait to see more about this.

Secondly, Mitaka/Lt's CRL is, in my opinion, the most up to date and accurate First Order CRL, utilising a tonne of information and references which were not available when Hux and the subsequent General (Hux's CRL, minus appearance stipulations tbh) was released.

We've nipped and tucked at Hux, to bring it more in line with an acceptable level of accuracy since release, but oh BOY is there still a lot of work to do there. I would request if possible, that Mitaka's upcoming CRL be the "benchmark" for First Order officer uniforms, over the existing CRL's for Hux and the General which have a large number of inaccuracies and poor wording issues.
The uniforms do have very striking differences from one rank to the other.. frustratingly... but there are very definite aesthetic and construction similarities which run throughout the First Order as a whole. Mitaka's CRL is super-solid and I'm far less anxious it be used as a base for first draft for Major, than the existing Hux.
(I'd also like to request Hux and the General go through a series of changes to bring those CRL's more in line with Mitaka/Lieutenant, but that's a discussion for another time.)

Definitely following this one.